[chat/question] AH's Secret New Game -- features you'd like? (that weren't in Helldivers & Gauntlet)


#1

Hoping this could be a fun little “food for thought” question. AH can’t talk to us about the Secret New game (maybe not for years), but I think we could just talk a little about features (big or small) that we wanted in Helldivers, that we didn’t get, but would like in the new game. Or minor annoyances that we’d like the new game to take a different tact on, etc.

I realize this is kind of a leap of faith because it’s possible Secret New Game is in some other genre or has little in common with AH’s last few games (Helldivers, Gauntlet, Magcika). But let’s just assume it’s somewhere vaguely in the same gaming arena but much more ambitious. :sunglasses:

I had a couple things. Here’s one.

Squad Camera Lock Improvements
I was never someone who complained about the 'camera lock" with squads as a concept. It just drove me crazy when my guy was injured and crawling – this always appeared to “break” screen lock, so then if a squaddie walked away from me, the screen scrolled past me and I could no longer see myself or have any awareness of surroundings (the pointer arrow helped not at all). 99% of the time this caused instant death.

My suggestion had been maybe having a little “mini video popup” that just showed your downed character and immediate surroundings. At least enough to know where I was and what was around me, and even if I’d been able to get up off the ground at all. Easy for me to say, not easy to code :grin: So I would just say I hope that if Secret New Game has squad screen lock, that it has some way to better handle injured, crawling players’ characters impacts on the screen lock effect.


If Arrowhead could still develop the Gauntlet, what would you like to see?
#2

Oh yes, getting killed by being pulled off screen is incredibly annoying. In fact, I’ve been thinking about starting a post that lists the mean and twisted aspects of the game which I and those I know could easily do without.
If I could add one thing that I would really like to see in the next game, it would be for the play to be the determiner of outcomes and not stupid capricious events. I’ll provide an example:
Several times now I’ve joined games where the play is over, and the results are failed missions. Rather than simply cancelling the mission, the game shows me a short glimpse of an empty play map, and hurries me to mission results where I’m assigned a failed mission. This really makes me want to quit the game. If the game is going to assign defeats in such a capricious manner, then the game needs to stop recording losses, and probably even wins.
The irritating part of this is that I didn’t get a chance to even appear on the map. If the game is going to slam players in this fashion, it isn’t a game I want to play.
If this were the only mean and twisted aspect of the game, it wouldn’t have me considering a post on this topic. In my own admittedly small circle, HD has earned a reputation as a sick game, which is not a compliment.
What could change this for the better?
I’m glad you asked: DO NOT RESPAWN DEAD PLAYERS INTO IMPOSSIBLE SITUATIONS, this is not amusing or entertaining, it is just there to stick it to the player. Believe me that no psychologically healthy player finds it cute or worthwhile for the game to prove that it can kill you whenever it wishes.
TONE DOWN THE “FRIENDLY FIRE”, while uncertainty can enrich the game, regularly getting mowed down by one’s own people is tedious and unnecessary to the game.
Similarly, killing players via turrets deployed to aid in defense just makes one less willing to expend the strategem slot upon one.
MAKE STRATEGEM CHOICES VIABLE, a good game doesn’t waste effort giving players one million choices of wet noodles. Either have the courage to offer something that is truly effective, or don’t offer it. We have a wide array of genuinely stupid strategem choices, from pathetic smoke, to the healing droid that takes forever to rebuild a players health, to the distractor beacons which are so nerfed they are essentially useless. Contrast this with truly viable strategem choices like the Firewall, the MG 94, and the resupply pack. Make them work, or leave them at home.
This might seem a little harsh, but after several dozen deaths via character seeking pods, any slack I gave to the game is gone. Useless strategems hinder quality game play, and the constant effort of the game to capriciously disrupt and destroy one’s game is at best completely exasperating.
Hopefully, this will be taken as constructive criticism to build a better game.


#3

Although I doubt Arrowhead would ever change friendly fire – assuming the Secret Project has FF too – I kinda like the concept of maybe “random % chance to hit-friendly fire,” such that maybe friendly fire (i.e., fire from a comrade pointed at you) has a random chance to miss you.

I confess I don’t know if it’s feasible for the game to “know” that your projectiles/lasers are about to hit a friendly and then react differently. It’s just a deep thought in my shallow brain. :grin:

Guess it’s inspired by the times in Firaxis’ XCOM games where you have a 93% chance to hit your target at near point blank range with no obstructions, and you wildly miss anyway. :laughing: If there was a way to implement FF in that form in a co-op twin-stick, then perhaps you could still have friendly fire but in a sort of “toned down/nerfed” fashion.


#4

The issue with friendly fire operates in three different spheres that subtract from enjoyment of the game.
First it is important to realize that very very few players are going to have any familiarity with small unit tactics. This means that they have no idea how to successfully manage their fire discipline. Thus, even higher level players tend to blaze away regardless of results. It gets extremely tiresome to routinely lose equipment and ammunition because of careless discharges.
Secondly, F.F. actively punishes players who prefer to deploy their own equipment, rather than relying on the red strategem mother to solve problems. It’s simply a fact that a certain group of players murder others for their equipment. Sure, one can report or sometimes kick them, which are useless gestures for modifying behavior, or put up with it, however the fact remains that this condition exists because of game design, period, and it remains a serious obstacle towards enjoying the game.
Thirdly, F.F. is capable of complete outcome determination for a mission, and as such it is simply too powerful. I have directly experienced this on multiple occasions, and it is disempowering as a player to have a game decide to slap you with a loss just for yucks no matter how you play.
Listen, games can have F.F. enabled without ramping it up to the point that it becomes a major determiner in play. How about a friendly droid that returns one’s equipment? How about a time lock that prevents others from running off with your gear and using it? Even if this only worked for 5 min. it would discourage equipment murders. There are all kinds of ways to mitigate F.F., circumstantially and in wider play. Whatever happens with the new game, my hope is that players will have more opportunities to overcome the capricious forces that are practically omnipresent.


#5

Also, I wanted Dune Buggies in Helldivers or the Secret Project… or maybe a Golf Cart :grin:


#6

This is maybe not so much a game feature - more a parallel suggestion - but now that pretty much all of us players have an iPhone or Android phone, i’d love for the Secret Project to have an integrated smartphone app that plays into the game somehow.

Or at the least something where you could pull up data n your smartphone screen about how your character’s doing. And if the new game has anything resembling Helldivers’ global campaign, enable the app to track how the campaign is going and optionally send you alerts about important changes in campaign status.

Also, if the new game has anything like the “onboard encyclopedia console” that your Helldivers ship has, this should be in the new game’s app so you can easily access basic tutorials, enemy descriptions, gameplay tips etc.

I think these are just cool ways to keep you connected to and engaged in the game, but all the actual gameplay would still be in the game itself, not the app. So I don’t think it would take away from the game itself.

Obviously Arrowhead isn’t a smartphone app developer so it might make more sense to assign it to a smaller team that has experience with that type of programming.

I pushed for this for Helldivers but clearly app-support probably would’ve had to be baked in at the beginning, and I don’t know if the BitSquad/Stingray game engine supported that type of thing. Perhaps the new game can offer this kind of app support. :slight_smile:


Wishes and dreams
#7

I’d be glad for any hint from developers about what will the game be like. Because it’s hard to discuss and dream about game, which could be sci-fi, fantasy, screen-sharing MP like the rest of your games, or just some regular FPS, RTS, RPG, anything.


#8

I’ll say that as much as I liked the four built-in auto voice macros (No! Yes! Move! etc.), I might’ve liked 8 choices, and then maybe let the player choose the four they think they’ll most often use. I and others pushed for a “Sorry!” or “My bad!” macro for unintentional friendly fire instances for example.

Also I think “Get on the Ground!” or “Incoming! Take cover!” would be more helpful than “Move!” when dropping high power stratagems. Or whatever equivalent the new game has. :slight_smile:

I’m suggesting this even if the Help Wanted ads suggest extensive friendly AI units and artificial intelligence programming, such that maybe we don’t even need other players anymore. :thinking:


#9

I think we just have to accept that Arrowhead’s publisher (Sony or whomever) won’t let them say a word about the game until an official announcement is approved and made. So nobody’s going to give us a hint unless he/she wants to get fired. :laughing:

Even the Arrowhead CEO no longer leaves evasive bread crumb non-specific riddle comments about the secret project in his Twitter feed anymore, which is why I stopped Following him.

I’d suggested this thread to just encourage people if there’s something Helldivers lacked that they wanted, then let’s let them know here. There seems little point in suggesting things for Helldivers specifically now that we know nothing substantive is further planned for it – other than to just torture ourselves. But we can still impact the direction of the new game.

And just not worry about what genre the secret game will be. I feel like we have every wild guess reason to believe it’s in a similar vein but very much more ambitious.

It’s the combined Helldivers and Gauntlet teams plus the 14+ some odd new devs they’re hiring. I don’t believe they’d join two twin-stick shooter dev teams together and ask them to make a first person IKEA Store Shopping SImulation, right? I would guess they’d ask them to keep working on what they know best but push it further, innovate, make it more ambitious, etc. In a few years, hopefully we’ll know if I’m right or not. :slight_smile:


#10

If there was one thing I would wish for in HD that was not included, it would be species specific weapons as effective against Cyborgs and Illuminates as the Toxic Avenger is against Bugs. Let’s face it, the TOX is a Bug weapon. It’s only moderately useful against Cyborgs, and almost completely useless against Illuminates.
Well, how about a Freeze gun that causes metal Cyborgs to collapse?
How about a Sonic gun that ignores shields and hammers Illuminates?
Right now there are truly few stratagem weapon choices that work well against all three alien scumbags, so in keeping with this, having species specific weaponry for all aliens is something I wish was included.


#11

I think one now moot idea I had for Helldivers was that once you reached a certain Helldivers level and got all your weapons/stratagems fully upgraded, that the samples system might swtich over to a system that rewards you “consumable” items that you create using samples.

So maybe like X number of samples lets you ‘craft’ a one-use incendiary ammo or poison ammo magazine. Or like a consumable quick-heal.

This could’ve also tied in to the types of terrains you’re on and the alien faction you’re fighting.

Like maybe the samples on maps with lava would be used to create an incendiary ammo consumable. Maybe samples on maps the bugs are on could be used to concoct poison ammo consumables. Perhaps the Illuminate map samples would be used to create electro–shock ammo consumables. etc.

I say moot because I recall in one of the earlier Reddit AMAs one of the devs said there’s no intentions to add belatedly a “research sample sink” feature such that piling up samples no longer becomes pointless after a certain point. I understand that. But maybe the new game could have something like that. :slight_smile:


#12

Here’s something I wanted in Helldivers that we never got, that I think would save some time and help out when you join a group in progress but only have I think 15-20 seconds to figure what you want. My idea below may be tricky to ‘fit’ on a controller because Helldivers already pretty much uses everything. That would be up to some smarty-pants Arrowhead programmer/UI guy to figure out. :grin:

Loadout Configuration Presets

Tom Clancy’s The Division finally added this feature like years after release, and it was really a godsend in terms of 'building" a few favorite loadouts – favorite primary weapon, secondary, various body armor/clothing pieces etc. – and then just clicking one button to ‘load’ it.

SInce Helldivers likes thinking in “fours,” maybe provide us four “loadout” slots.

Each loadout configuration slot is a favorite:

  • Primary Weapon
  • Perk
  • Stratagems 1-4

You configure it as you like it, and then it uses a dropdown menu to let you SAVE AS the configuration to name.

It might have some default configuration slot Labels:

  • A, B, C, D
  • Alpha, Beta, Delta, Gamma

That takes less space in terms of text but isn’t really useful when scanning a short list of config loadouts.

Or they could maybe build in a database of slot labels that indicate the types of stuff you equip, and let us assign them. Maybe something like:

  • My Favorite Loadout
  • Solo, Co-op
  • Mass Destruction, Bullet Hell, AT Specialist, Support Specialist, Vehicle Specialist, Exosuit Specialist, Air Strike Commander

I guess the tricky part might be squeezing that ‘configuration loadout choice’ onto the menu aboard your ship (or whatever the equivalent might be in the new game if it’s at all similar). On controller, it might make more sense for it be a horizontal ‘scroller’ list where you go L-R through loadout choices quickly via L-R shoulder buttons. On PC maybe more clicking the entry for a pop-up vertical list of loadout choices, and you just LMB click one to load all your favorite stuff quickly.