New Perk Ideas


#21

Likely, yes. Among Helldivers I rarely see the Punisher. Most gravitate towards the Breaker or the Trident, as far as shotguns go.

However, the perk is mostly for helpful utility. Much like the laser pointer perk. Do we need it to aim? Not really, but it’s pleasant.


#23

That’s fine. My point even from the from the beginning was based on my point of view, as yours is based on what you see (or rarely see). Neither of us can speak for any other players except ourselves anyway.

So yeah, to reiterate, the reload speeds in Helldivers are fine to me. If someone else has complaints about the reload speeds, I guess it’s just not a sentiment I share. Maybe Arrowhead will sympathize though.


#24

Chemsuit Perk

This perk protects the Helldiver from toxic chemicals and poisons making the user immune to the Stalker bugs slowing toxin.

It is most useful when working around the tox-13 avenger, and can mitigate some… Accidents with it’s use.


#25

Mechanically, isn’t the SH-20 just a better version of this?


#26

In many ways, yes. However, that is a stratagem that occupies a gear slot. Furthermore, it’s not often active under fire.

The suggested perk, though less powerful, is always on and allows one to still carry support weapon ammo, etc.


#27

I like the idea, could it also resist fire? It would make much more sense.


#28

Well, Spitzer suggested that too:


#29

That does make sense and would raise the value of the perk to be more on par with heavy armor.


#30

The concept of Perks is a curious one, especially since I find overlap between Perks and Strategems. However, I think it would be extremely useful if there was a Perk to reload vehicle weapons, or even a strategem for this purpose.
The ability to resupply vehicle ammunition would make the Rep80 more useful, since this is primarily a vehicle repair strategem, and would also extend the usefulness of the Walkers, which have minute ammunition capacity.
I also agree with those who think that some type of speed reload would enhance play, and could be incorporated with the vehicle reload.


#31

There is a speed reload mechanic in the game that takes effect if you reload when you’re not empty :smiley:

As I’m sure you’ve noticed, there are some vehicles with incredible weaponry.
If we open the gates to vehicle reloading, then you suddenly have a one-hit wonderbus with infinite ammo…
There’s a reason why vehicle stratagems are limited use, as with the turret and turret placement strategems — it transforms the game experience entirely. The aspect of limited use of vehicles and their ammo is the only thing keeping them from being overpowered.
Even allowing resupply of mechs only would feel a bit silly, and I think the only compromise we could really get is reloading bullet-based ammo only: the turret on the bike, the minigun of one of the mechs, the side cannons on a bus, etc, but even that feels like a strange thing to do. To me, anyway.


#32

O[quote=“9.0, post:31, topic:460, full:true”]

There is a speed reload mechanic in the game that takes effect if you reload when you’re not empty :smiley:

As I’m sure you’ve noticed, there are some vehicles with incredible weaponry.
If we open the gates to vehicle reloading, then you suddenly have a one-hit wonderbus with infinite ammo…
There’s a reason why vehicle stratagems are limited use, as with the turret and turret placement strategems — it transforms the game experience entirely. The aspect of limited use of vehicles and their ammo is the only thing keeping them from being overpowered.
Even allowing resupply of mechs only would feel a bit silly, and I think the only compromise we could really get is reloading bullet-based ammo only: the turret on the bike, the minigun of one of the mechs, the side cannons on a bus, etc, but even that feels like a strange thing to do. To me, anyway.
[/quote]

9.0
One could just as easily mention that reloading speed increases for weapons with some ammunition in the magazine is silly. There is absolutely nothing practical about this practice, it is purely a gaming assumption.
We all have different notions of what is OP. I find the term overused. I cannot imagine the motorcycle, which burns and explodes so easily, as OP. I actually find in my gaming sessions, the only vehicles regularly deployed to be the Walkers, nor is it unusual for a player to load two or more into a mission. Perhaps you will explain how resupply is contributing toward OP, yet loading multiple walkers is not?
I enjoy Helldivers, yet the game does have some strange idiosyncrasies. The idea that weapons mounted in a vehicle cannot be resupplied is one of them. Again, this is pure gaming convention.
Vehicles deployed in combat carry a specific supply of ammunition for immediate deployment, with the obvious understanding that this supply can be augmented in the field according to ammunition expenditure.
Translating this into the fictional Helldivers universe, there is no difference in sending hand held weapon ammunition, or vehicle mounted weapon ammunition, in a pod.
I cannot imagine that a simple resupply for vehicles will suddenly see the game transform into a OP frolic. I do see that it would enhance gameplay.
Thanks for the response, 9.0.


#33

I’m not sure what you mean, but in case you don’t trust me, here it is: https://helldivers.gamepedia.com/Weapons#Fast_Reloading

Of course.
To be able to resupply all vehicles would mean that the more weakly armed vehicles get resupplies as well as the most strongly armed vehicles.
For a weaker vehicle, this doesn’t mean much in terms of firepower, but for a powerful mounted cannon, this means you don’t have to worry about ammo conservation of your potent weapon, as you can always drive away from conflict and resupply.

There are 7 vehicles in the game, all of which can be used as a movable turret placement.

Only 3 (as far as I’m aware, correct me if I’m wrong) can kill heavily armoured targets in one shot.
Do you know how much ammo they each have after upgrades? 15, (Walker) 35, (Bastion) and 50. (HAV)

I already feel like the HAV’s 50 worth of instant kill to any target ammo is too many, but my point is:
With this resupply upgrade, that 15/35/50 becomes unlimited.

There would be no point to conserving ammo, there would be no point in avoiding patrols since you can just blast everything to hell. (especially with the HAV)

And yes, deploying multiple vehicles is very balanced at the moment, as you sacrifice an entire stratagem slot which you could have used for: Resupply, a Back slot, a Support weapon, or the myriad of support, offensive, and defensive strategems.

Again I agree that it seems like the lack of reloading for vehicles is purely mechanical, but then look at half of the vehicles: they would need to be disassembled for their weapons to be reloaded, as they are very tightly armoured.
So then mechanically, only allowing half the vehicles to be resupplied doesn’t sound very fun.


#34

I see the topic of “I wish we could reload vehicles” come up from time to time. I’ve got to say, I really think Arrowhead hit the mark. I’ll leave it to each person to decide for themselves what they would consider to be “OP”, but speaking for myself, I’m really glad we can’t reload vehicles.

I don’t particularly like mechs (at least not the way most people use them), but as it is now, I can kinda live with how they are. If I’m hosting a game and someone joins with a mech, I’ll probably just put up with it until the mission is over, then ask them not to bring it to the next mission (or at least not multiple ones). If I knew mechs could be reloaded and used forever, I’d probably be much more inclined to ban them from my rooms entirely.

I like knowing that mechs can eventually die or run out of ammo and that I don’t have to play the entire rest of the mission with this thing next to me and I’m trying not to get stomped by it the whole time.

If you’re going to keep using vehicles, I think having to spend a whole other stratagem slot is a reasonable price. Considering how strong they are, the current downsides of using them are well more than fair.


#35

Short answer on vehicles (which many of us have asked about as far as reloading etc.) is they don’t want you to NEED vehicles or exosuits; and they don’t want anything in the game to be TOO OP. Right or wrong, they’ve given impression that letting you reload Exosuits or vehicles would in fact make them feel TOO OP and TOO NEEDED, rather than something you use for a limited period of time.

Besides which, you can just bring 4 of the same vehicle strats and use it all mission-long if you want, to get around the ammo limits.

Arguably the AT manned turret is TOO OP. But they’re here to stay I assume.

Me I think a separate mode where you ARE vehicles or exosuits (not Helldiver characters), and you just spend the whole game in vehicles or exosuits period, and you customize and upgrade your vehicles and exosuits in a much more long-term fashion. That might be interesting.

Could be like the short-lived MMORPG Auto Assault Or maybe too much like World of Tanks. But probably that’s another thread. :slight_smile:


#36

I must disagree that the ability to resupply vehicles leads to unbalanced play. When I play online, it is often with others whose characters are lower level than my own. Vehicles help them to play against enemies they simply would not have the weapons to confront. Thus, vehicles help them to achieve a certain level of parity, they do not contribute to OP.
More advanced players often choose to handicap themselves, and play with weapons that are of limited effectiveness to increase the challenge. This style of play is obviously going to negate anything perceived as too powerful, whether or not it’s a vehicle.
Certainly there are those who overuse vehicles. My character has gotten killed too many times to mention by various vehicles, and the majority of the time, it is accidental. Dying however is simply a part of the game. Putting this in perspective, my character has been killed a greater number of times by fellow players on foot.
A vehicle resupply perk or strategem takes up that space, reducing or precluding other choices, which makes the decision to use it significant. At this point in my play, I cannot imagine any gaming situation where resupply would dominate the game to the point where it becomes OP.
Besides, vehicle resupply could have a limit in terms of the number of total reloads, or require longer resupply times, or both to balance the perk/stratagem.
The vehicles are present. They are being used. The notion of non-dependence is an interesting one, but I cannot agree that vehicles are something that lessens or derides play. A well deployed vehicle is just as much a rewarding experience as a game done purely on foot.
Finally, I have to conclude that many players, especially higher level players, feel that since they don’t want vehicles, nobody should have them. Please try to keep in mind that Helldivers is excellent because it is flexible to many different styles and skill levels of play.
Thanks for the thoughtful replies.


#37

Resupply vehicles would be too OP, x4 Exosuits can help you survive Helldive without dying once even when you are low rank and unlimited ammo would make EVERY low rank take the same loadouts (x3 Exosuits + Healing gun) it would be too OP as people mention above also. Helldice is not for easy run, you need to think, take the most effective gear against the enemy you will fight with and be skilled. That’s why few planets are locked to new players. If we would have vehicle ammo resupply we would see low ranks where they shouldn’t be yet with their exosuits and every run would be boring as hell.

You can take Rumbler as example, everyone takes it on bugs because it’s too OP! It’s boring to see Rumbler player killing Behemoths all the time.

It’s just my opinion though.


#38

This just made me realise that I wouldn’t mind if Heavy Armor suddenly got an upgrade to resist fire & poison & confusion as well, I think the slowness would finally be an equal tradeoff - I’ve always felt like it was only an effective choice against Cyborgs.


#39

That would be a great idea, perhaps it should still damage you, not set on fire or poison you to death/downed state.


#40

I feel Arrowhead don’t want you to have it too easy and are happy with the balance…

  • Friendly fire and kamikazee hellpods
  • You are always outnumbered & the enemy is without number.
  • No permanent map view - vulnerable when checking it.
  • You may go prone to avoid fire but cannot shoot back
  • Ammo in the clip when reloading is discarded.
  • Reload is cancelled if interrupted with another action.
  • Unable to move when reloading certain secondaries.
  • Hellbomb detonator has about as much resistance to damage as a pinata
  • One handed weapon and no running when carrying.
    … the list goes on.

Short answer - you must suffer and sacrifice for your victory.


#41

I don’t think I’ve ever seen anyone (low level, high level, or this thread or anywhere else) say they don’t want vehicles at all or that nobody should have them, or anything to that effect (I know I certainly didn’t say that, anyway).

The presence of mechs have a relatively (in comparison to weapons, etc.) large influence on the room. Whether you mind that or not, like it or don’t, it is what it is.

The host is the lord of the room. Host decides what goes down in the host’s room. That doesn’t mean you can’t or shouldn’t commend or report them or leave, but their room is their domain. Sometimes hosts just don’t like the presence of mechs (or whatever their dislikes are) in their rooms.

I don’t even outright hate mechs. I even bring them from time to time for fun. The thing is, I tend to only use it for like one area of the map, then I ditch it, whereas a lot of players (especially beginners) stay in them for as long as they can.

If it’s someone else’s game, I can leave. If it’s my own game, sure, I can kick them, but I’d rather not do that when mechs already don’t need any sort of buff in this regard. Like I said in my previous post, if I see someone brought like one mech, then whatever. I’m usually fine with that. But if I knew a mech’s life could be expanded significantly, I’d probably just switch to an outright ban on mechs (like I do with AT-47s), and I’d really rather not have to do that.


Anyway, that’s why I don’t like the idea of reloading vehicles. That’s not why I think it’s an actual bad idea. I think it’s a bad idea for other reasons. For one, I actually am in agreement with those that say it would make them OP. Plus, this whole time I was assuming you’d still need to use an ammo calldown in order to refill it, but now I’m realizing it was probably meant that you can refill it just on the merit that you have the perk on, and if so, holy hellpods that is broken.

For another, it’s not a stand-alone perk—and that’s a big part of what makes them perks. This would be a perk that requires you to configure your loadout a certain way in order to be even minimally useful (you have to bring a vehicle, and it becomes useless anyway when they’re all gone). No other perk does this (All Terrain Boots on Desert are useless, but their usefulness never has anything to do with your loadout—only the mission). Stratagem Priority is at least useful for yellow stratagems at all times, and you’re never without whatever you choose your sidearm to be, and you’re never without a weapon that could use a laser sight, etc.

I think voiding confusion is too much. Confusion is a huge part of fighting the Illuminates. It’s the single biggest aspect of them—their three toughest units (including the boss) pretty much revolve around that feature. I think if you nullify that, you’re basically not even fighting the same guys anymore.

That being said, stopping poison and fire would be really nice. I’d be down with that. I think that could put it on par with the viability of some other (what I would consider) better perks.




A popular idea (it’s not only mine–I’ve seen a lot of people have it or agree with it) that I think at least deserves a mention on the thread would be the buffing of Strong Arm to include increased damage when using melee.